Early Childhood degree

Early Childhood degree

by: the-voice-of-reason - 11-02-06 16:46

Birbs, think very carefully before following the extremely irresponsible advice given by fairy100.

Fabricating evidence regarding your suitability to work with young children will be a very dangerous thing to do. Any employer worth their salt will ask for references from your so called 'voluntary placements' and you will then have to own up to having lied on an application form.

Whilst the theory of child development is essential knowledge, so is the practical experience that nursery nurses gain on their work placements from college. A huge part of their two year full time courses are taken up by working hands-on with children and gaining valuable and absolutely necessary experience that goes hand in hand with the theory for an all round knowledge and understanding of children.

Your degree qualification will be enhanced by practical experience gained by working with children, so go ahead and get your experience, but please don't lie - you run the risk of seriously damaging your reputation, not a good start to a career in childcare!

by: Birbs

Hi, thankyou for your reply, don't worry i would not make up my work experience. I know how important it is, expecially in this sector to be honest.

I think i will have to put my theory into practice and gain experience once uni is over.

Early Childhood degree - 20-02-06 16:23

by: iggyfishtank

Well, most places as for a NVQ level 3 or equivilent. Having a degree, like i will have come may, gives you a level 6 qualification. You should also use holiday time to get experience in the early years from a range of settings so you have a cv as long as your arm. Its what i have done and i am now hot property. I am a man though so that pushes me up the desirablilty list and is something i am not sure you can do much about. Unless you are very commited!!

Early Childhood degree - 20-02-06 18:09

by: Birbs

Unfortunately i don't have any experience but that is something i am hoping to change come the summer.

Early Childhood degree - 17-05-06 23:40

by: Bren

Well the foundation degree does make you a level 6 BUT only with other childcare qualifications AND experience. I am currently doing the F.D. and work full time as Manager of My setting I have my NNEB which took me 2 years full time and I have 30 years experience working in childcare and I can promise you you would NEVER walk into a Management job staight after the F.D. because for one thing a manager has to have a minimum of 2 years POST qualitying experience to pass the OFSTED requirements.

Early Childhood degree - 17-05-06 23:56

by: Bren

your best bet is to do the teaching course which with your degree i believe it will only take you 1 year to complete. Hope that more helpfull to you all.

Early Childhood degree - 01-06-06 10:28

by: unibird

hi ya i completed my degree in early childhood studies in 2004. came out with a 2.1 but to be fair most employers on child care don't really care and just love the fact your qualified "above and beyond" the others. luck of the draw i think. i spent 2 years feeling that i went to uni for nothing cos im still flipping nursery nursing :) but am going back to uni in sept to do PGCE. however not like this for everyone, my mate landed a wicked job as resident social worker for local council. just really really go for it. good luck

Early Childhood degree - 09-11-06 22:12

by: katie

Hi there, I am studying "Early childhood studies" part time at the moment and I have managed to work in a nursery as well as studying for my degree. If I was not working in a nursery I would struggle with my degree. It also comes in useful when doing research projects.

Early Childhood degree - 30-11-06 08:54

by: hatthar

I am worried that some of the Early Childhood degrees available include very little practical experience with children. I think for you qualification to be worth more you need to gain much more experience working with children, maybe in your holidays.

I also feel worried that some people feel that they are qualified above and beyond others by completing a degree. One of the most important things in a nursery is team work, and if some staff start by feeling they are better than others, this will not help.
Please don't judge other qualifications that you don't know much about. When I did my NNEB, we did one week in college and the following week in placement for the whole course. During the college weeks we were in lectures from 9am till either 5.30 or 6.00pm every day, and had to complete whole shifts when working in placements.

I don't doubt that a degree is hard but don't belittle other qualifications you know nothing about!!

Early Childhood degree - 04-12-06 12:54

by: cityofbristol

Am currently doing a FDa in ecs, and luckily, for me, we spend a day in placment every week to help gain experience. the bad thing about ECS degrees is that they DONT give u a licence to practise, for that you would need NVQ level 3.

Early Childhood degree - 05-12-06 21:12

by: Sonia25

Hi everyone, I'm studying Early Childhood Studies (long-distance) with London Met uni and hope to specialise in an area in the early years if possible.Not sure where to start though, I'm still struggling along as I'm in my 2nd year but feel like I've been doing this for much longer!

Early Childhood degree - 25-03-07 18:43

by: Birbs

I was not belittling any qualifications at all...i was told that my qualification was not as good as other nvq, btec etc because i went the a-level route not levels 1/2/4 in childcare so wanted to know if that was true-i was concerned i had wasted 3 years.

Anyway, i have come out of uni and am not working as a deputy manager of a creche, they trained me up, and i have gone back to uni to do the Early Years Practitioner Status course.

Early Childhood degree - 17-07-07 22:08

by: sweet_female

A degree is level 6 and with a early childhood studies degree you are MORE than qualified to work in a school or nursery. The previous post is correct in saying once you have gained the degree that you have a qualification which means you could apply for a mangement role but the difficulty with this is the lack of experience which unfortunately is the nest way

Early Childhood degree - 29-07-07 23:33

by: lilly

Is anyone else slightly disconcerted by the people who do a degree but have no childcare experience and then expect to get a job as a lead professional or manager? I have worked with children for 10 years with children aged 0-8 and am now a manager, but I would not employ someone if they had a degree with no experience as I feel it would undermine all my staff that have worked so hard through the NVQ route and have many years experience working with children having worked their way up through the ranks. It takes more than knowing theory of child development to work with young children day in day out. I am currently working towards eyps and the experience I have of working with children day in day out has been invaluable. I'm just a little worried about the people who think just because they have a degree they are suitable to work with children.

Early Childhood degree - 30-07-07 07:17

by: janny

Hear hear loubybelle, I agree, qualifications are great but should go hand in hand with experience, something you cant learn in a classroom!!

Early Childhood degree - 30-07-07 18:06

by: Tunja

I have just completed my early childhood degree. It would have been impossible to complete without working with children at the same time.How else can you observe children, write diaries of their behaviour, plan for change etc. I worked 50 hours a week in childcare while I completed my degree!

I will be going on to complete the EYPS. To get this you have to demonstrate you have worked with children from a wide age range and in a variety of settings and not be inexperienced as you suggest.

Whilst I have an NVQ3 it is only a stepping stone. Some are content to remain at that level, others prefer to continually improve their practice.

Early Childhood degree - 30-07-07 18:19

by: iggyfishtank

{quote}Hear hear loubybelle, I agree, qualifications are great but should go hand in hand with experience, something you cant learn in a classroom!!{quote}

Well that is the attitude that holds people back. Its like saying the degree is worthless as if you havent had loads of experience then your level 6 qualification isnt worht anything as you have to start at the bottom where the skills and advanced knowledge you learned at uni wouldnt be best utilised. Also by having people that need to start at nursery nursing after a level 6 it just shows that they have wasted their time as they could be doing that after leaving college with an nvq 2/3. Whats the advantage of doing a degree if this is the way?

[quote]but I would not employ someone if they had a degree with no experience as I feel it would undermine all my staff that have worked so hard through the NVQ route and have many years experience working with children having worked their way up through the ranks. It takes more than knowing theory of child development to work with young children day in day out. I am currently working towards eyps and the experience I have of working with children day in day out has been invaluable. I'm just a little worried about the people who think just because they have a degree they are suitable to work with children.}

You cant think like that otherwise you are undermining the work that person did at uni surely. If you worked at level 3 then someone with level 6 is going to be more likely to have the skills to do a higher level job as that is what their training is for, surely! I agree that it takes more than child development to know how to work with children, but you say you wont even employ them. So they will never find out the other parts of it. Doing a level 6 qualification takes time and dedication so some people may not be able to do aot of experience while studying or if they do have time then have to work in places that pay more than minimum wage to support their own studies.

You could quite easily interchange the last statement by saying just becasue they have a level 3 doesnt mean they are suitable to work with children. Well, obviously. In fact it is more likely they are able to work with children as gettign onto and completing a degree course is much harder than getting onto a NVQ 3 course and completing that.

There seems to be a suspicion in general about degrees and that becasue you havtn come through the NVQ route you are to be suspected as thinking you are better and that in reality you have not got any idea about working in a nursery.

Early Childhood degree - 31-07-07 08:16

by: janny

I dont want to get into a slanging match here iggyfishtank, but I do still maintain that qualifications should go hand in hand with experience and my attitude doesnt hold anyone back, in fact I am currently working towards a degree but have 17 years experience behind me. I'm all for everyone trying to better themselves and do infact encourage it amongst my staff and other colleagues, however, I still maintain that experience counts for alot and cant be learned in a classroom, however I wouldn't not interview/employ someone if they had a degree and no experience, I take each candidate on their own merits etc and hope that others would too.

Early Childhood degree - 31-07-07 20:14

by: iggyfishtank

well, what is the point of them doing the degree? You get a qualification which proves your ability and suitability for a job otherwise it is a nothing. If you wont even interveiw them then they will never gain experience will they? How are these people going to ever get a job if employers like you wont employ them even though they are moe than qualified to do the job.

Early Childhood degree - 01-08-07 07:52

by: janny

If you read my message again you will see that i said I wouldn't NOT interview them, I would and I take each candidate on their own merits. I know from experience that the best qualified is not necessarily the best person for the job. End of discussion I think!

Early Childhood degree - 03-08-07 22:34

by: iggyfishtank

sorry u r right, i diddnt read it properly my fault. I apologise. :)

Now can we please sort something. Does it (a degree) qualify you to work or not? Either it does or it doesnt. There are required levels and experience quotas to acheive (or were on my degree course) and so it should qualify you to work.

In the same way NVQs are for people who are not academic, degrees can be more useful for people who are. Now as we all agree that vocational and academic (i am making an assumption here) are equal then someone gaining a level 6 qualification is qualified to do something that a level 3 does, right? Now obviously the person doing an NVQ will have more experience as the qualification takes place in a setting. That should not mean that you handicap someone who is academic. Not their fault if they prefere the academic route and can best show how they perform in this way. Yes?

In an NVQ you prove your ability to work in the setting during a degree you prove it during exams/presentations/assignments with links to settings so that you are not just theorising.

I do not understand the idea of a EYPS. Surely it is to prove you have reached a level of competence (as it is meant o be like QTS). The one problem with this is that newly qualified teachers can go right into their job after qualifying. If you do a degree you cant to this right after so doesn't lead anywhere. If you have worked with a load of children in different setting then your cv will reflect this. What are the newly qualified people with degrees (that are meant to give you the skill to lead a team/setting anyway) going to do? WE have to start at the bottom where our higher level skills are not going to be best utilised and completely nullifying the point of going to Uni to get the higher level skills if we have to start where we would if we had done a level 3.

Here is a bit of idle specualtion. It is not backed up by evidence or anything - just shooting from the hip. OK:

I beleive that many people are, in some way frightened, of the degree. That the skills are being learned but you havnnt seen them work in your setting or another setting for more than a week or so. Many people, having gone through the NVQ/NNEB system themselves feel this is the best way for people to train as its what they did and if its good enough for me then its good enough for them! Yeah you can analyse two different settings on outdoor play and put in a theoretical framework while giving the setting a suggestion on best practice
from your research on world nurseries but can you comfort a child? Wheres your presentation on that smartpants??? Eh? Eh?

Comforting a child can be learned very quickly by someone who has completed a level 6 qualification (as im sure would be the same for level 3 - not saying they couldn't). If a candidate can quickly learn how to do higher level skills then you will have to give them time to learn some of the more 'basic' (if you want to call it something else then call it that, was just the 1st word i thought of) things. These things can be learned in weeks if not days, the skills a level 6 (however achieved) will bring will take years to develop.

If you do not give the graduate the time to learn how to overcome these obstacles then they will never gain the experience many people want. Remember you can always take them in for a trial day to see how they cope. Its not like you have to employ them for life after interview. Most people then are employed on a probationary period anyway and if the person isnt any good you give them the boot and call the next best person in. Now while this can be expensive that is the case for any candidate in any other job. I do not see why early years is special case.

Not taking a graduate because 'there are some things you just cant learn in the classroom' is like saying the sphynx in Egypt is rubbish cos someone lobbed off his nose (Napoleon was it?). Even when, in this case, the nose can be re-attached quite easily...if you follow the analogy.


....and breathe.

Early Childhood degree - 05-08-07 22:00

by: Birbs

I understand what people are saying about experience it is essential and i can also understand the frustration the more experienced child care workers have about this topic. I was fortunate that my creche allowed me the oppotunity with limited experience. I have been there a year since i wrote this post and have also been doing the EYPS and have done various work experience and voluntary work to gain experience and although some people feel that i may not be deserving to be in a management position i have worked hard and am continuing to gain experience in mang settings. Schools, nuseries, volunteer portage work etc. I am hard working and dedicated and this last year i feel i have shown that i am deserving and suitable for the position...it's easy to say people wouldn't have employed someone in my position but my nursery obviously felt that i someone who could and have contributed to the setting.

I guess this is why a lot of people argue with the EYPS Course but at the end of the day me being the deputy manager and having been trained up for the last year, like with what i am also doing with the EYPS is no different to a person doing a degree in english then a one year course to be a qualified teacher.

The most important thing is we are all dedicated and have a passion for working with children, if we weren't good at what we do we wouldn't get employed in the first place, it's important to understand that although people have different experience/qualifications we all want the same thing when it comes to children.

RE: Early Childhood degree - 09-09-07 20:51

by: Tink84

I have a degree in Early years: care and education and childhood studies. Yes the downside of the course is that it doesn't provide you with the practical work experience you require to be a manager etc.

However, i never dreamt of being able to land a job as a manager with no experience and neither did those that gained their degree with me. We all knew that we would need to gain work experience prior to obtaining a higher level job and as a result i get paid min wage while i gain work experience

RE: Early Childhood degree - 01-09-07 09:44

by: poison dwarf

A foundation degree is a level 5, not 6. I have an NNEB and 10 years experience and my fd is still a level 5. If it was a level 6, myself and the others on my course would not have to continue studying in Sept for a degree whcih is level 6. I need to top up to degree standard (not hons) to complete my EYPS. If the FD was level 6 I would not need to do that.